CUHOF 1 runs tracked return

[Puja]

I saw that there was some discussions about the instances so I figured I would track a couple of runs.
I've bunched them up in 3 sets of 5 runs ;)
I did all of my runs whit a ghost set using a Mayhem LR-20

Unamped runs	70,4% efficiency
Starting PED&Ammo	Loot not sold(shrap converted)	pure ped	Ammo	summary	pure TT loss
838	40,03	493,11	295,07	828,21	9,79
788,18	37,04	485,5	262,58	785,12	3,06
748,08	9,35	501,3	222,94	724,24	23,84
714,89	22,71	494,96	196,63	714,3	0,59
691,59	20,74	503,45	155,41	679,6	11,99
658,86	10,02	495,93	139,49	645,44	13,42
	139,89				62,69

The first 5 sets of runs I started whit 838 PEDs&ammo and ended up whit 775,49 pure TT.
If I would have added the Mirsal whit a 1100% markup it lands at 829,09 PED
The rest of the loot was pretty much so low that there was no reason to add it since the 1100% on the mirsal is abit high aswell.
I also crafted simplel 1 springs for the oils I got from the runs and whit that i took a little loss ending at 809,11 PED whit MU

Unamped runs	70,4% efficiency
Starting PED&Ammo	Loot not sold(shrap converted)	pure ped	Ammo	summary	pure TT loss
632,32	22,53	494,76	107,49	624,78	7,54
602,25	25,56	487,14	77,94	590,64	11,61
565,08	30,9	479,35	36,33	546,58	18,5
515,68	22,77	271,83	206,97	501,57	14,11
478,8	40,78	267,4	162,85	471,03	7,77
	142,54				59,53

The next 5 runs I started whit 632,32 PED ended up whit 572,8 pure TT
618,9 PED after counting the mirsal at same rate as befor.
And after crafting simple 1 springs I actually ended at 652,29 PED whit the mirsal MU.

Amped runs	73,8% efficiency
Starting PED&Ammo	Loot not sold(shrap converted)	pure ped	Ammo	summary	pure TT loss
558,2	32,16	226,76	284,19	543,11	15,09	(lucky msg run)
510,95	39,85	211,19	257,95	508,99	1,96
469,14	21,33	207,06	231,78	460,17	8,97
438,84	28,48	191,62	207,41	427,51	11,33
399,03	23,98	175,7	185,3	384,98	14,05
	145,8				51,4

I did another 5 runs but this time using my amp on the gun to see how much of a diffrence that made.
Started the runs whit 558,2 peds and ended whit 506,8 pure TT
Whit the MU 542,3 PED
And after crafting the springs 554,13 PEDs whit mirsal MU




The 11th run I actully got this message about increased reward.. however this was the run whit the highess loss in this set.

 

[Littlestar b-k]

That is like 91% tt-return. That is so mutch better then it used to be.

CUHOF 1 runs

I'll be doing a few runs on cuhof 1 and will post loot. Depending on how loot is it might not be alot ;) using a V 10 edition corrosive chip with lvl 4 ul amp. run1 54.87 ammo used, 4.88 repairs, 52.55 in loot +1ped key run2 56.14 ammo used, 5.06 repairs, 45.09 in loot...

www.virtualsense.eu

 

[Miles Stardust]

Thanks for logging and sharing you runs Puja, I think the message of "better loot this run" is BS. If anything it's worse. This needs to be addressed - but presumably it's an MA thing.

Peace, Miles

 

[Littlestar b-k]

Maybe loot gets readjusted because there is supposed to drop something of x value.
The x was never added.
Just a tought i had.

 

[Hally]

Thanks for logging and sharing you runs Puja, I think the message of "better loot this run" is BS. If anything it's worse. This needs to be addressed - but presumably it's an MA thing.

Peace, Miles

What i have seen is a small tendecy that the loot in those instances has had more nawacore parts or weapons, but its such a small difference, that the promise isnt really fulfilled

 

[Miles Stardust]

What i have seen is a small tendecy that the loot in those instances has had more nawacore parts or weapons, but its such a small difference, that the promise isnt really fulfilled

I did three runs through Cuhof 3 recently - the third run got the Bonus Loot message, and was the only run without Misral, CoreParts, Items or even Key Parts. The second run had much higher loot than the other two, which were very similar and low-end normal.

Oh, well.

Peace, Miles

 

[Puja]

Maybe loot gets readjusted because there is supposed to drop something of x value.
The x was never added.
Just a tought i had.

Ya maybe it was somthing that was being worked on but never got finished but they implemented the message but not the actual loot it was supposed to have.

 

[Darth Revan Reborn]

Are you calculating all of your decay (weapon/amp/armor, etc) into these runs? Is that included in the PED & Ammo section?
Reason why i am questioning is that if i get a 6ped loss in Cuhof 1, that amounts to 90.20% (on average) TT return. A 10 ped loss works out to be 82.75% (on average) TT return.

Your tracking is also painting an incorrect picture. You are putting your total TT and final TT values that you have on you, not your cost and return of the instance.

To give you an idea of what i mean, where you have:
The first 5 sets of runs I started whit 838 PEDs&ammo and ended up whit 775,49 pure TT.
That leads to an incorrect assumtion that your return for that is 92.54%. That assumes you spent 838ped and returned 775.49ped, which is not the case. Your loss is 62.51ped/5 = 12.50 ped /run

If it cost you 60ped for a run, then your return is 60-12.5= 47.5/60 = 79.17% tt return for that run.
If it cost you 40ped for a run, then return is 40-12.5 = 27.5/40 = 68.75% tt return for that run.
If it cost you 100 ped for a run, then return is 100-12.5 = 87.5/100 = 87.5% tt return for that run.

Thats using the average as a loss, but your loss values differ a lot because of small number of runs.

Now if we say that you did indeed spend 838ped over those 5 runs, then on average that is 167.6ped per run...which is not possible to achieve in the instance unless you let the mobs regen health (which i don't think they do anyway). If you did somehow manage to spend that, then it would give you the 92.54% return.

The other discussion was about how the returns in instances are not giving good returns and need to be looked at, and your tracked runs are providing a different story because of what information you are providing. So if you have what each run cost and what each run returned to you, we could get a better idea.

I used a BC-45 and no armor over 50 runs in Cuhof 01
Average cost i did over 50 runs with same setup is 60.58 ped, average loot is 51.92 ped, works out around 85.7% average return.
No MU included (pure TT) as that should not be included when tracking to see what return the instance gives, MU is always subject to change ... especially with Mirsal.

 

[Puja]

Are you calculating all of your decay (weapon/amp/armor, etc) into these runs? Is that included in the PED & Ammo section?
Reason why i am questioning is that if i get a 6ped loss in Cuhof 1, that amounts to 90.20% (on average) TT return. A 10 ped loss works out to be 82.75% (on average) TT return.

Your tracking is also painting an incorrect picture. You are putting your total TT and final TT values that you have on you, not your cost and return of the instance.

To give you an idea of what i mean, where you have:
The first 5 sets of runs I started whit 838 PEDs&ammo and ended up whit 775,49 pure TT.
That leads to an incorrect assumtion that your return for that is 92.54%. That assumes you spent 838ped and returned 775.49ped, which is not the case. Your loss is 62.51ped/5 = 12.50 ped /run

If it cost you 60ped for a run, then your return is 60-12.5= 47.5/60 = 79.17% tt return for that run.
If it cost you 40ped for a run, then return is 40-12.5 = 27.5/40 = 68.75% tt return for that run.
If it cost you 100 ped for a run, then return is 100-12.5 = 87.5/100 = 87.5% tt return for that run.

Thats using the average as a loss, but your loss values differ a lot because of small number of runs.

Now if we say that you did indeed spend 838ped over those 5 runs, then on average that is 167.6ped per run...which is not possible to achieve in the instance unless you let the mobs regen health (which i don't think they do anyway). If you did somehow manage to spend that, then it would give you the 92.54% return.

The other discussion was about how the returns in instances are not giving good returns and need to be looked at, and your tracked runs are providing a different story because of what information you are providing. So if you have what each run cost and what each run returned to you, we could get a better idea.

I used a BC-45 and no armor over 50 runs in Cuhof 01
Average cost i did over 50 runs with same setup is 60.58 ped, average loot is 51.92 ped, works out around 85.7% average return.
No MU included (pure TT) as that should not be included when tracking to see what return the instance gives, MU is always subject to change ... especially with Mirsal.

The ped/ammo is after repairs are done and its what I have left when the run is done.

I have not tried to calculate a average revenue return on the instance since doing so on 15 runs is pretty much just gonna give you a incorect value, also doing so whit 60 isnt really saying much either you would probably would have to run a few thousand times in order to get somthing that is close to correct.

What I have tracked is how much ped I lost after each run and my starting ped only is there in order to keep track of how much I've lost in no mean have I tryed to track what i revenue in the instance since I feel like that is irrelevant and what is importent is how much ped I actually have left and not what % of the peds I have lost.

This gives me a couple of intresting numbers for me that I can keep and so some further cals later on for example to give me an idea of how much a apparment would cost me to get if I keep runing the cuhof 1's.
Whit this run of 15 it will probaly get a pretty inacurate number but still a number and it would land at 5787 PEDs or a 1 387 ped loss if I sell the tokens for thire MU at the time I did the runs.


"Average cost i did over 50 runs with same setup is 60.58 ped, average loot is 51.92 ped, works out around 85.7% average return.
No MU included (pure TT) as that should not be included when tracking to see what return the instance gives, MU is always subject to change ... especially with Mirsal."

I included the MU the end beacause I felt it would be inrestesting to see same as I find your runs abit interesting aswell, for me the average mirsal on my runs where about 0,8~peds mirsal wich would mean if I did your runs I would have had a loss of 33 peds for 50 runs whit the 1100% markup on the mirsal.
And each runs take what 12m?
That would mean I would for 33 ped get 10 hours of entertainment

 

[Levi]

Hey Puja,

Before you try to add the mark-up to the tokens why not try and sell some of the tokens for that amount and see how successful you are.

I have done the same runs and math you did and I have a very different result.

The way I did it though was purchase x amount of ammo that I knew would take to run the instance +20 additional PED of ammo to make sure I don't run out.

After the instance was complete I would repair my weapons and armor and add that to the total cost of peds spent on ammo.

I would then add all the unused ammo and all items earned into the TT to see the combined amount of return I got and it was around 80% most times or lower this was me using the ArMatrix BC-20 (L) which has a 63.2 efficiency.

I have not done an instance for a week or so but will try again and see if I can confirm your results, hopefully I will!!

 

[Puja]

Hey Puja,

Before you try to add the mark-up to the tokens why not try and sell some of the tokens for that amount and see how successful you are.

I have done the same runs and math you did and I have a very different result.

The way I did it though was purchase x amount of ammo that I knew would take to run the instance +20 additional PED of ammo to make sure I don't run out.

After the instance was complete I would repair my weapons and armor and add that to the total cost of peds spent on ammo.

I would then add all the unused ammo and all items earned into the TT to see the combined amount of return I got and it was around 80% most times or lower this was me using the ArMatrix BC-20 (L) which has a 63.2 efficiency.

I have not done an instance for a week or so but will try again and see if I can confirm your results, hopefully I will!!

Hi Levi

I dont see how I wouldnt be able to sell for that markup, I've seen in chat that many feel like the markup should be less but this is the fact:

In the last 30 days 317 PEDS of mirsal has been sold at the average markup of 1610% I used 1100% in the calcs because that is more in line whit how it is weekly but its still a underestimate value if you look at it in the long run.

What I have posted is MY experience in the instance this does not mean that you have the same.

If you do go and do some runs feel free to post it and share your experience

 

[Lucky Great Eddy]

Yeah prices on MS are so bad because tnx to Ordres they put there 900% and 925% so people start selling between 950-1000% I believe prices will go more down us new orders will show up. Btw to make normal break even price on MS they must be sold at least 1400-1500% MU

 

[Hally]

Yeah prices on MS are so bad because tnx to Ordres they put there 900% and 925% so people start selling between 950-1000% I believe prices will go more down us new orders will show up. Btw to make normal break even price on MS they must be sold at least 1400-1500% MU

And right there is the hard part, at 1400% a small appartment costs 5600ped and a large shop cost 224k ped

 

[Heidi Stassinopolis]

And right there is the hard part, at 1400% a small appartment costs 5600ped and a large shop cost 224k ped

That's why i sold all my 8.5k of mirsal on AH, to my mind it makes more sense to try and loot a random page mining crafting and hunting, at least the return should be around 90%+ which doesn't seem to be the case in cuhof

 

[Lucky Great Eddy]

From looting page vision its okey but from economic perspective for selling all estates it is not so cool
We have somehow get these tokens out form instances that investors might buy them out - all we know they will cut the prices very fast us the last shop will be sold and nobody will care about apartments....

Personally me - I go in instances because of MK core upgrade and hoping that in token trader will shop up limited items for token prices where only limited players would get some nice stuff

 

[Miles Stardust]

When looking at Misral Markup, you should ignore sales prior to The Royal Decree in the beginning of December. The prior sales and MU were based on very different circumstances, and not much actually changed hands.

More generally, I think the MU is insane. If the value of Misral is in anyway bound to the value of deeds, it should be much lower - and I say that as one who has already looted 35k Misral.

For now, I'm collecting and holding - I'm not in it for the money - and hoping for a Page drop of course

Peace, Miles